I Make $10k to $30k Per Month Working Part Time On My Sweet Food Blog

Need some well timed recommendations on tips on how to develop an viewers and model from the bottom up?

Jessica Holmes is on the podcast to share the surprisingly distinctive views she’s gained from rising a profitable meals weblog.

Simply as a pattern:

• She desires direct site visitors greater than search engine marketing site visitors
• She makes use of the ideas of high quality customer support to assist develop her viewers
• She hardly ever appears to be like at key phrase instruments to supply matters
• And he or she does not draw back from displaying the nice, the unhealthy, and the ugly when testing the recipes she shares on her weblog

It began again in 2014 whereas juggling a full-time job as a copywriter. Jessica needed a artistic outlet, so she began up her weblog sweetestmenu.com.

Initially, she knew nothing about search engine marketing or turning her website right into a enterprise so it was a real interest weblog.

She’d promote her content material primarily on social media till a pivotal second in 2016 when she transitioned to an search engine marketing technique after an audit with Casey Markee.

However this isn’t your conventional ‘search engine marketing’ story.

Her content material technique closely prioritizes the precise reader over any search engine algorithm, and it appears to be working.

As an example, Jessica emphasizes the significance of making content material based mostly on reader demand and suggestions somewhat than the standard key phrase analysis method.

She appears to be like to the reader, then her personal pursuits, then the season, after which if needed – a key phrase analysis instrument.

She additionally speaks overtly and actually in regards to the challenges of sustaining a profitable meals weblog, together with the necessity to replace outdated posts and the significance of partaking with the viewers and offering wonderful customer support.

And the cherry on prime is that she does all of this whereas working ‘part-time’ on the location!

It actually is an excellent dialogue and Jessica has a whole lot of nice recommendation we might all begin testing on our personal blogs.

Take pleasure in!

Watch The Interview

Matters Jessica Holmes Covers

• Turning her ardour undertaking into her enterprise
• Getting onto Mediavine
• Interacting together with her viewers
• Prioritizing what’s greatest for readers
• Direct site visitors vs different varieties
• Her method to key phrase analysis
• Humanizing content material through fails
• Recipe testing
• Fostering a 2-way dialog
• Offering an ideal buyer expertise
• Following by means of
• Updating content material
• Adapting to vary
• Monetization
• And an entire lot extra…

Hyperlinks & Sources

Transcription

Jared: All proper. Welcome again to the area of interest pursuits podcast. My title is Jared Bauman. As we speak we’re joined by Jessica Holmes with sweetestmenu. com Jessica, welcome on board. 

Jessica: Thanks. Thanks a lot for having me. I am an enormous fan of the podcast. I have been listening for many of this 12 months and I’ve truly discovered a lot from this podcast, so actually comfortable to be right here.

Jared: Oh man. It is at all times nice to have a listener on board. You form of know the stream, you understand how we love to do issues round right here. However we, uh, our time earlier than this podcast and the intros was tremendous fast and simple. You already know the way issues go. So it is nice. It should be nice to have you ever. And, um, I am, I am very excited to speak about your web site.

, we have been speaking earlier than we hit report that. Through the years, we have a tendency to finish up interviewing a meals, a meals blogger, if you’ll, right here or there, and it has been a short while since we have had one on, and it has been a short while since we have had one on following this type of bevy of Google’s updates in 2023 and the tail finish of 2020.

Um, I am actually excited to speak to you immediately about the way you grown this web site and what you are as much as. Why do not we begin by, by doing it like we at all times do. Possibly give us some backstory on who you might be and catch us as much as once you began, um, sweetestmenu. com. 

Jessica: Yeah, certain. Nicely, I began sweetest menu in 2014, uh, which is a lifetime in the past now arising 10 years.

Yeah. So, um, however after I stated I used to be very humble beginnings, I used to be working full time as a copywriter and I used to be doing graphic design courses at night time they usually have been ending up and I used to be simply on the lookout for one thing artistic to do. My spare time, I had no youngsters, so the evenings and weekends have been all mine. And, um, I used to be.

Head over hills in love with meals blogs, following so many. And um, yeah, my husband stated, why do not you begin a meals weblog? And I used to be a bit hesitant at first, however I did it and I did not inform anybody for a superb six months I believe, however I simply dabbled with it, had a whole lot of enjoyable. Didn’t, uh, ponder it turning into a enterprise or a profession in any respect.

Um, it was simply pure enjoyment. However I did fall in love with it and I learnt. Nicely, I am nonetheless studying, however, um, I simply discovered a lot in regards to the running a blog world and I believe I most likely received hooked on running a blog when individuals began to depart feedback and say they tried one in all my recipes or simply inform me that my.

Pictures look nice or one thing, you realize, it was again when individuals left a number of feedback on blogs And I simply could not consider individuals from around the globe began to search out me began to use and revel in my recipes and I simply received hooked Nevertheless it was about 18 months It is in, it was nonetheless purely only a interest, however I began to look at these different larger bloggers round me begin to flip theirs into companies.

Like I used to be following, you realize, pinch of yum, Sally’s baking habit, a few of these huge huge websites. And I used to be like, Oh, they’re turning these right into a enterprise. That is fascinating. And, um, my dad stated to me, why do not you place some adverts in your website? And I used to be like, Oh no, dad, I do not need adverts ruining my good aesthetic.

, I used to be, I used to be actually hesitant, however then I used to be like, Oh, why not? So I. Threw on, um, I simply signed as much as Google AdSense and that first month I made 50 and I simply thought that was unbelievable. Like I used to be like, somebody is paying me cash to do what I am simply loving and, you realize, pay for my components that month.

I simply thought that was unbelievable. Um, so that is the enterprise. technically began. And I take into consideration two years after I began, I then converted to media vine and it is type of, you realize, began to develop into greater than only a interest, however I truly continued doing it as a facet hustle for six years. So I stayed in my full time profession for six years earlier than transferring over to turning into a meals blogger in March, 2020.

Jared: Wow. Okay. Uh, so that you went full time, uh, geez, that is mainly when COVID hit truly, proper? Yeah, 

Jessica: it was actually fascinating. So the day I, I give up my job and the day I packed up my desk was the identical day that each one my colleagues have been packing up their desks as a result of they have been advised they needed to go make money working from home for 2 weeks after which it ended up being two years.

Yeah, it was very unusual time, however it labored out although prefer it’s horrible few years, however, um, it was superb for me as a result of it had the baking search, you realize, and everybody was at house. And so I received this huge 2020 and 2021, this huge site visitors surge. Um, so I received to essentially take pleasure in and type of experience that wave, which was.

Contemplating it was an actual bummer of some years, 

Jared: I used to be going to say, I imply, I, I, I do know that, uh, we have had journey web site homeowners on, you realize, uh, for the reason that pandemic, and clearly that was an enormous downswing for them adopted by a resurgence. I’ve received to think about with so many individuals being at house, maybe you left your full time job to show to this full time, maybe that was truly.

Wanting again on it fairly good timing. Like, did you see a reasonably sustained bump in site visitors because of that? 

Jessica: Sure, I did. I did. And what was good was I did not rely on that. So it wasn’t like I left whereas I used to be in the midst of that search pondering it was going to be like that endlessly. So by 2019, I knew it was a sustainable enterprise.

So I would, I would out earned my day job. I used to be incomes extra doing this than my day job. In order that’s why I felt type of comfy leaving. After which, yeah. After which I had a very massive 2020 and 2021. It was, Um, lovely surge of site visitors, like effortlessly simply going up. It was fantastic. And 2022 and 2023, it has undoubtedly come again down, however nonetheless larger than prefer it was 2019.

Um, however it was a bit unhappy to look at that. Like, yeah, slowly come again right down to a extra like even unfold of site visitors. Yeah. 

Jared: The, um, you realize, I are likely to ask this query. To lots of people who’ve an internet site that is perhaps like 10 years outdated, like yours is, and particularly within the meals area. I am simply curious. Uh, you do not have to spend a ton of time going into it, however a whole lot of occasions the arc of site visitors sources for a ten 12 months outdated website will change.

And a whole lot of occasions the site visitors arc for, for meals, for meals web sites will change. Like, did you lean closely on say Pinterest site visitors? Within the late 2016, 17, 18, 19. After which, you realize, like the place’s the site visitors coming from nowadays in comparison with perhaps the primary few years? Yeah, 

Jessica: that is a very good, um, query. So sure, it was undoubtedly extra social heavy and undoubtedly Pinterest was the most important driver, uh, in these early years.

After which I had my first search engine marketing audit in. 2016. So 4 years in, and that was after I, and that was with Casey Marquis, who I consider you have had on the present. Um, and. Via implementing a whole lot of the ideas that he made, that is after I was capable of actually like faucet into search engine marketing site visitors for my website, which is now the primary site visitors driver, however previous to that, it wasn’t an enormous site visitors driver for my website.

Jared: Attention-grabbing. Yeah. So that you made the transition, um, uh, let’s, uh, I like to do that. Lots of people like to do that. We’ll get into the nitty gritty of, of a whole lot of the small print you utilize to form of, to construct this, this website out and a number of the issues that make it distinctive, however perhaps catch us as much as proper now, any numbers, any, something you are comfy sharing by way of the location, the place it is at, whether or not it is site visitors, monetization, variety of articles, like simply to offer individuals an thought of the scope of the place you are at virtually 10 years in now.

Jessica: Sure. So I’ve over 500 recipes, I consider on the facet. Um, and I am getting someplace the site visitors. Ebbs and flows so much all year long. So I am at the moment having fun with my fantastic December, which is at all times lovely. Since it is a baking weblog for those who do not know, um, yeah, everybody desires to bake in December, which is superior.

Um, however my site visitors type of ranges from about half 1,000,000 to 1,000,000 web page views a month. Um, and yeah, it was larger. Like we talked about earlier than, it was larger than that in the last few years, getting as much as round 2 million. And so it is. It was come down, um, however it’s good and good and constant, which has been actually good.

Um, after which clearly the advert income adjustments fairly a bit, however that most likely sits round, uh, it might be something from 10 to 30 Ok a month. 

Jared: Yeah, yeah. Congratulations. How superb over 1,000,000 individuals your recipes a month. That is phenomenal. Nicely, um, you realize, I, I, I’ve a whole lot of questions. I did spend a while in your website earlier than and I used to be telling you beforehand, you talked about Casey.

I might, after interviewing him, I might virtually see a number of the. The threads of, uh, uh, uh, or perhaps the fingerprints of him on the location. We’ll, we’ll hyperlink to his interview for, for these of you need to hear, that is most likely a few 12 months and a half outdated now, however it’s nonetheless tremendous relevant by way of the issues that he shared on the podcast interview.

However, um, you needed to transition to an search engine marketing technique from, it appears like a extra social media. I imply, we will use that to transition into. Form of the way you constructed the present website. Was it a type of issues the place you have been simply noticing some site visitors from natural search and saying, properly, I need to pursue that? Or was it actually extra of a call to say one thing’s altering in social media, for instance, like I’ve received to change my site visitors sources.

Like how purposeful was that transition to deal with search engine marketing? Um, it 

Jessica: was fairly purposeful. I believe, particularly after I had the audit with Casey, I believe, um, I simply actually noticed a whole lot of potential in that it wasn’t essentially turning away from social media. It was simply along with I used to be simply seeing how highly effective it was and I am seeing it by means of a whole lot of different individuals, to be sincere, greater than myself, how they have been rising their websites.

Um, However my search engine marketing site visitors was simply slowly rising and, uh, it was rising fairly effortlessly. I believe as a result of I assume the entire like passive earnings factor, when you begin to rank and when you get, you realize, many pages which can be rating, it is simply working for you within the background time and again and over. So I used to be simply very eager to have that, um, working for me, uh, if that is sensible.

So as soon as I had my first, um, Okay. I then began to implement that and I’ve truly had three audits now with Casey through the years as a result of as you realize, one thing’s preserve altering. However to be sincere, if I went again and listened to his first one, I believe a whole lot of his recommendation can be very comparable. There’s just a few little quirks which have modified over these occasions.

However the, on the finish of the day, he is at all times speaking about, um, What’s greatest for the reader? And I believe, you realize, that is nonetheless what we’re all harping on about in the mean time. Um, and what Google retains attempting to inform us to do, um, although, you realize, generally they misinform us a bit bit. However, um, yeah, so that is what I that is what I am attempting to do.

And I believe. With my website, I’ve at all times been a very massive believer in, I believe, and I believe this comes, so I am simply attempting to assume, I believe this comes from, as a result of I’ve at all times had a whole lot of interplay with my readers, whether or not that is by means of web site feedback, by means of social media, by means of e-mail, you realize, individuals ship me their photographs of their recipes that they’ve made.

I’ve at all times felt very near the reader. So I’ve at all times tried to have an actual, um, method. So although SEOs. undoubtedly a excessive precedence for me on the finish of the day, I need to be doing what’s greatest for my readers. And, you realize, lots of people get a bit shocked when, you realize, I do know there’s a whole lot of meals bloggers and different individuals that can go actually heavy on key phrase analysis.

However like for me, if a reader. If a number of readers say like, I actually love this recipe and I, I, you realize, do some key phrase analysis and I can see like, I am by no means going to rank for that. Like, in case you take banana bread, proper? I am by no means going to rank for banana bread. It is by no means going to be an search engine marketing key phrase for me that I can contact, however.

I am not simply not going to do this due to that, as a result of if my readers need that, then I would like to put it on my website. And on the finish of the day, I would like my readers to have the ability to come straight to my website. And if they need a banana bread recipe and there is not one there, then that is form of a disservice to them.

Does that make sense? 

Jared: It does. I imply, it does. And that was going to make my subsequent query, which is A typical search engine marketing centered web site goes to do key phrase analysis and they will provide you with a wide range of recipes which can be going to go of their content material calendar. And perhaps, perhaps they will deal with breads for the month or two to form of construct out what’s, you realize, what may be thought of topical authority.

It appears like perhaps, perhaps you are taking a little bit of a special method to the way you provide you with the matters which can be going to go on the location. And I am curious to listen to the way you do provide you with them. Yeah. 

Jessica: So it is much more fluid. So I do have a content material calendar, however. Um, on the finish of the day, I believe as a result of it is a artistic web site, I really like the artistic facet of issues.

So if, if I come to per week and I believe, properly, you realize, I had deliberate to do a pumpkin pie, however I do not actually really feel like doing pumpkin pie, however I’ve simply, I’ve simply had this nice thought of doing a cheese scone as an alternative or one thing, you realize, like that, then I’ll undoubtedly change issues out. I do not like sit exhausting and quick to issues, however I actually do hearken to what my readers need.

In order that they do. Always ask for recipes, and I do have an enormous checklist of what they need, and I attempt to then do the key phrase analysis after that, simply form of see what I can put into the submit. Um, however yeah, I undoubtedly, I am not a conventional type of key phrase analysis first form of individual. I actually do go along with what the reader desires, after which I am going with what I would like, after which I most likely take a look at seasonality after which I take a look at key phrase analysis.

So. Yeah, I do not know if that is, that is incorrect to inform individuals as a result of it isn’t essentially, you realize, like following the Google rule, however it works for me. And on the finish of the day, I would like search engine marketing site visitors, however you realize what I would like greater than search engine marketing site visitors. I would like direct site visitors. I would like folks that simply go, I need a dessert.

I am simply going to sort in sweetestmenu. com and are available straight to me and people individuals. I would like them to search out what they’re on the lookout for after they come to my website. So that will imply doing recipes that do not essentially rank in Google. 

Jared: How, the place does search engine marketing come into play? As an example you make the banana bread recipe, if we might, which I checked your website.

I do not. I do not see banana bread right here. Okay. I could not discover you do rank very properly for banana cupcakes, by the way in which, however, however, um, anyhow, I digress. Let’s simply take the banana bread, uh, matter and run with it. Like, as an example you will make that and you realize, whether or not or not you look forward of time or not, you have form of already decided, wow, that is a really aggressive key phrase from an search engine marketing standpoint, however my readers need it.

I’ll make it. What do you do? What, the place do you add the search engine marketing elements? The place do you optimize for search, although you are specializing in content material that your customers need greater than perhaps a search engine desires? Sure. 

Jessica: Yep. No, nice query. Um, for that, clearly for me, that is available in all of the formatting of the submit.

So I’ve a type of, uh, uh, unfastened format that I persist with. Um, you realize, with totally different headings and totally different matters and the way I need to format my submit. So often, you realize, that is speaking a bit bit about submit, sorry, speaking a bit bit in regards to the recipe. I like to incorporate one thing in my submit that I do not see many individuals together with, which is recipe testing.

So after I take a look at a number of recipes, I, um, uh, or iterations of the recipe, I ought to say, I take photographs of it and my, my, my readers like to see it fail. So I like to put these photographs within the submit the place I can. And I believe. Now that just a few years in the past, I received advised to not try this as a result of it is sometimes, you realize, not likely an search engine marketing factor to place in there.

Um, however now I really feel prefer it might be as a result of with AI and every little thing like that is form of proving that I am an actual individual. I’ve actually examined this in my kitchen and nobody can actually faux these. Nicely, I imply, they will faux, however yeah, it is actual recipes, actual exams, actual fakes. Uh, sorry, actual flops when it does not go properly.

Yeah. So I put that in after which clearly I simply break down the submit. Now I attempt to put in course of photographs for Google, um, and for my readers. After which I attempt to actually, um, put in like professional suggestions or ceaselessly requested questions. And I get a whole lot of that once more from my. Readers somewhat than I do examine Google and see, you realize what persons are asking.

Um, but in addition I simply know I get a whole lot of frequent questions, so I do know what my readers are sometimes going to ask. Um, and even it might are available later. So if I publish it on Instagram or if a remark is available in they usually, you realize, need to ask, Oh, can I exploit a special form tin or, um, what can I add this combine in as an alternative of that blend in, then I would go in and add that.

Into the submit. So I am simply attempting to reply each query that I can within the submit. Um, After which, yeah, after which clearly like a totally optimized recipe card and very nice photographs with, you realize, alt textual content and all these type of issues. So nonetheless attempting to comply with all of the search engine marketing guidelines, however type of doing a bit bit my method.

Jared: I am wanting on the recipe testing and also you’re, you are precisely proper. It, um, you are, I am wanting on the one on chocolate buttermilk cake and you’ve got totally different. Footage showcasing once you use melted butter versus vegetable oil and so forth. It jogs my memory of one in all my favourite web sites. Uh, as a result of I’ve gotten into cooking with a sous vide through the years has been critical eats they usually do the very comparable factor the place they will present you footage of, Hey, prepare dinner it at 165, prepare dinner it at 160, prepare dinner at 155.

Here is 4 hours, here is eight hours. And I really feel like I am studying, however you are proper. It additionally reveals the, uh, reader. And maybe the algorithm that you just’re truly testing these various things. Sure, 

Jessica: that is proper. And that was one thing that through the years, I believe it simply began by chance. When, uh, on, you realize, Instagram tales, I’d usually have a peek in my kitchen and I, I simply stored placing out like, Oh, you realize, this did not work and it could be a horrible cake with an enormous gap within the center or spilling over the edges.

And I observed that I simply received a lot. Suggestions on these photographs and simply so many individuals going like, Oh, wow, that is actually fascinating. Or that occurs to me too. And it was like, individuals additionally did not notice that I’ve these fails on a regular basis in my kitchen. And I used to be form of a bit shocked. However then I assumed, Nicely, I assume that is sensible.

For those who’re continuously simply being bombarded with these lovely photographs, they simply assume I am this, you realize, wizard that simply All the things works and it is fairly reverse. Most issues do not work in my kitchen . In order that they, um, I assume it humanizes me a bit bit and, um, I like to share it as a result of as I am studying then, you realize, I, I can share that suggestions with them after which they be taught and, um, yeah, they appear to essentially take pleasure in it.

In order that’s type of the place it stemmed from. 

Jared: You discuss the way you do some issues a bit otherwise. I imply, perhaps I simply needed to ask a bit extra about that as a result of I am wanting all, you realize, very first thing that stands out to me is all of your headers are in lowercase font, proper? So you are not capitalizing issues like regular, just like the, the search engine marketing, the search engine marketing and me goes, Ooh, I do not find out about that, you realize, like.

There are some issues as I take a look at your submit, how do you make these selections? Like what, what causes you to form of go, I’ll write this header, you realize, virtually like I am texting somebody somewhat than, um, a basic header and another stuff you do since you assume it is extra on model than, than, than, you realize, correct or no matter you need to name it.

Jessica: Yeah. Yeah. That is a superb query. That is a step that actually, that call. stemmed from after I received, I received an internet site redesign, however I do keep in mind Casey flagging that with me, um, with the headings, however we did not change it. So whether or not that is, yeah, whether or not that was a superb choice or not, I am undecided. However, um, it’s exhausting although, as a result of it routinely.

Lowercase is it? And if I unintentionally have the cats loft on, um, I can not inform, however then it reveals up within the, um, trigger now I’ve the bounce hyperlinks. So if I’ve, yeah, if I’ve, yeah, so that could be a little bit of a headache, truly, if I might return, I am undecided if I’d try this once more. Um, however I believe for essentially the most half, other than perhaps the recipe testing part, um, I believe I most likely comply with many of the guidelines.

I am attempting to assume if there’s anything. I am going to let you realize if something involves thoughts. I am not a rule. 

Jared: Nicely, and also you talked about simply briefly. So I needed to form of perhaps dovetail that query to the subsequent one since you talked about it already. And I believe everybody would profit from listening to about this.

That is definitely one thing we’re all serious about proper now. And that’s. Adapting as maybe the principles as they have been modified. Proper. You talked about how, in case you went again and hearken to that first audit, once you first began search engine marketing again in 2016, you’re feeling like a whole lot of the stuff you’re doing now are pretty comparable, you realize, making content material for the consumer, however you’ve gotten, you probably did point out you have tailored, like what diversifications have you ever needed to make any massive ones that come to thoughts, any adjustments or pivots you have needed to do alongside the way in which?

Jessica: Yeah. Uh, there was quite a bit truly. And, uh, I am undecided how a lot of it’s that it has truly modified and the way a lot of it has been. I have been fairly sluggish to react, so I am attempting to be taught to be quicker. But when, like I stated, if I went again to that audit, Casey was telling me in 2016 to do course of photographs.

And I did not do them. I advised him, I’ve received a full time job. I haven’t got time. Sorry. Um, but when I had been doing that since 2016, I believe immediately I’d have been in a a lot stronger place. So, a few of these issues. Has type of stood that take a look at of time. However for me, I’ve solely began doing them religiously. So like, in each single submit, um, most likely within the final 12 months or two.

In order that’s an enormous one for me as a result of that is modified my whole, um, like not technique. Like, how do you say? Um, like daily operations, like to really publishing workflow. Yeah, yeah. Like I stroll workflow. In order that’s an enormous consideration. And that always means I am having to make one thing a number of occasions, as a result of if I solely have a sure window to, um, {photograph} one thing, I am going to have to have it, a completed cake or no matter it’s.

Um, after which additionally the steps I am usually making it. Um, full after which remaking it, excuse me to make, um, the method photographs after which remake after which rebaking it after which identical to having so many truffles to eat. So, um, yeah, it is it is actually exhausting to, like, handle that. However sure, in order that’s, that is been an enormous 1 and that is been an enormous 1 for my workflow.

Um, after which most likely simply being. Um, extra strong in, in my submit. So even after I look again now, I assumed I used to be writing actually useful posts. And now I look again and I like there was, the content material was very skinny and I used to be answering just a few questions, however there was so many extra that I might reply. And I believe for me, generally it is that cautious steadiness of.

Being actually useful, having a number of nice content material, which, which your readers hopefully take pleasure in, which Google likes, however then additionally for me personally, generally. Once I take a look at different bloggers who’re very profitable, generally I discover their posts too overwhelming. They have an excessive amount of data in there. Um, and by the point you get right down to the recipe card, I do not need to make the recipe anymore.

I’ve gotten so overwhelmed with all of the steps and the recommendation and every little thing. So I form of attempt to sit someplace within the center there. So it is. It is strong, it is useful. It is, um, you realize, answering questions with out being, uh, too verbose or attempting to achieve a magical phrase rely when there is not one. Um, and yeah, after which not being skinny and crappy as a result of the, as a result of truly that was the factor.

So, um, after I stated talked about earlier that, uh, my web page views type of have been coming off the COVID, um, rise, in addition they. I spotted I believe in 20, so 2022. In order that’s type of after I was contacting Casey once more as properly is I spotted I used to be having a whole lot of content material decay and I hadn’t actually, um, understood what that was.

So for me, I used to be type of nonetheless caught up within the running a blog world of publish, publish, publish new, new, new, um, , it was at all times extra, extra, extra, everyone seems to be a bit just like the social media, proper? Everybody’s hungry. As quickly as you do one submit, they need one other submit, preserve posting, posting, posting. And I wasn’t seeing, I wasn’t seeing an enormous decline, however I used to be simply actually flat lining.

And, um, I used to be, I began listening to a whole lot of podcasts and speaking to Casey and digging into my analytics and, and simply going like, why am I not rising? Trigger I used to be simply used to the extra you printed, you simply. The extra you develop, you assume it is simply going to be that upwards proper arrow. After which, you realize, when it was flatlining, I could not perceive.

And that is after I digged into my analytics and noticed that there was various content material decay occurring, the place a few of my posts that had been lengthy standing and doing rather well on the primary web page of Google had simply began to slide down additional and additional. And that is, and I began to look again and notice.

, I most likely have been a bit bit fortunate for a few of these to rank as a result of the recipes would possibly nonetheless be nice. And a whole lot of my recipes do stand the take a look at of time as a result of I retest them, however the posts should not nice. In order that they want gutting and redoing. In order that’s type of the place my technique has moved. I’ve utterly forgotten what your unique query is, by the way in which.

Jared: As a result of my subsequent query was on article updating. So, um, you realize, I used to be, that is truly the place I used to be going with it. I used to be going to ask you about it as a result of, um, maintaining with what has modified, proper, as issues develop and as issues, uh, adapt to definitely in 2023, a whole lot of what we find out about writing content material for the net is.

It is modified a minimum of in the intervening time and, and actually that does form of level to article updating, updating outdated content material. And it is fascinating to ask meals bloggers particularly about updating outdated content material as a result of in some ways, like your chocolate cake recipe does not essentially want to vary, proper?

It is the identical because it was in 2016, particularly in case you discovered a superb one. So What do you do once you return and take a look at a chocolate cake recipe that you just set has decayed by way of the site visitors? And like, how do you determine what to replace? What are you doing to replace it? How intensive are you going into updating all content material?

Jessica: Yeah, I am, I am going all in. So I often begin if it is a recipe that I have not made shortly. So a whole lot of my recipes, whilst outdated, I have been making it in my kitchen. So, you realize, I can, I do know it stands the take a look at of time, however, um. Yeah, a whole lot of it’s remaking that recipe. That is the place I’d begin is remaking it, ensuring it really works.

And generally it does want some altering. What I usually discover truly is, um, trigger I’ve gotten a bit older. A few of my unique recipes are only a bit too candy. I believe I simply had an actual like teenage candy tooth. So it was simply form of. Balancing that out. Um, and, however it’s even simply issues that it comes right down to, like with the components, um, I am, I am at all times attempting to put in writing, uh, you realize, for anybody type of on the earth, however the prime three international locations are Australia, the US and the UK, and all of us have totally different components with totally different names.

And, um, yeah, it is fairly complicated and even our cup measurements are totally different and our tablespoons to your desk. And so. Um, even, you realize, again within the day, it could simply be, I’d simply write it, you realize, because it labored for me. However now I attempt to put in much more notes, or now I do know, like, darkish chocolate right here is semi candy chocolate there, and issues like that.

So I truly replace how the recipe is written to be sure that all my components are literally listed appropriately, so far as, you realize. The primary viewers, um, as they perceive, after which additionally, um, I, it is even simply issues like my recipes. I am splitting it out into higher step-by-step. Steps as a result of I used to put in writing, you realize, I write a protracted recipe and it could be like three steps and it could be so exhausting to learn.

So now it is like breaking it up. And as I stated earlier than, I used to be a copywriter and although I used to be a copywriter again then, I am a significantly better copywriter than I used to be again then. So now I am going by means of and I may even rewrite it or rewrite the steps. I am a greater baker now, so I can perhaps even clarify. Um, tips on how to do issues a bit bit higher.

So primarily the recipe often stays the identical, however it could be type of rewritten. Um, after which perhaps tweaked a bit bit if there is a bit an excessive amount of sugar or it wants a bit extra salt or issues like that, however primarily it stays the identical. After which it is often if it is, if it is an older submit, it is, it is just about gutting the entire thing.

Um, and redoing all of the photographs. Um, and redoing every little thing from, you realize, the, tips on how to do it to all of the inquiries to, yeah, all that data. After which, and I exploit like, um, you realize, uh, preserve like content material optimizers after which I simply mainly go to Google and take a look round and see what persons are asking and issues like that.

Um, however yeah, I’ve received a superb place. Now I really feel like I’ve received a superb technique of how I construction my posts, however yeah, it is a whole lot of work. Such as you form of assume replace first is simpler, however I do not know if it is simpler than a brand new one or not. It is, it offers you someplace to start out, however I imply, and it might take out that recipe testing factor.

Like generally, you realize, after I create a recipe from scratch, I may be. Making it like six occasions or one thing. So clearly like with this, you would possibly solely have to make it as soon as or a couple of times and you’re feeling like, yeah, that is good. Um, however yeah, the entire gutting and redoing all the photographs is it is a whole lot of work.

Jared: Oh, I really feel like new content material is a lot simpler than updating all content material. It does not, I do. It does not make any sense intuitively, however I simply, yeah. Updating all content material is so troublesome. Do you 

Jessica: assume it is like, since you form of lose the creativity as a result of generally I simply go, I’ve received to do a brand new one as a result of I’ve received to get excited as a result of I get excited like, and that is how I get it out on social media as a result of I am so excited to share this new recipe.

And when it is an outdated one, although I adore it, it is nonetheless outdated. So like. I am excited. Not that excited. 

Jared: I believe it is actually exhausting to take a look at one thing you created. And although you realize it wants updating, it is exhausting to know like what wants updating since you have been so invested in it for at one cut-off date.

And so it is like, I do know this wants altering, however what am I going to vary? And it is exhausting to get that perspective on it. Whereas if you end up coming at a contemporary piece of content material, you’ll be able to simply come at it with all that vigor and all these new concepts with none form of obstruction to what’s and is not engaged on it proper now.

Yeah, 

Jessica: yeah, that is sensible. I, I really feel you there. 

Jared: Um, Hey, so let’s, I imply, search engine marketing site visitors, site visitors from natural search. It’s, I believe you stated about 65 % of your site visitors, however there’s an entire lot of different sources. , you have received social media. You’ve got, to my data, have a, a reasonably thriving e-mail checklist and e-newsletter.

Like I would prefer to get into a few of these issues. Um, uh, I assume from a excessive stage. How do you develop a loyal viewers or an viewers that wishes to return to your website, whether or not you are utilizing social, whether or not utilizing e-mail, whether or not utilizing natural, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, 

Jessica: I believe it begins, um, with actually viewing your small business and the social media as a two method dialog.

So, um, I simply actually be sure that I’m current and capable of discuss to my viewers. So I do know, and that is the issue. with outsourcing. So I do know lots of people outsource their social media and belief me, I’d like to outsource my social media generally. Um, however it places you additional away out of your viewers.

And that is what I’ve at all times been actually hesitant. So even, um, properly, one of many massive methods, which I assume is not social media, however individuals depart feedback on In your weblog posts. And, um, I reply all of them. So I learn all of them and I reply all of them myself and I am, you realize, 10 years in, I am nonetheless doing that day by day.

Um, and I believe that is a good way to remain near your viewers and to know what they like, what they do not like, what they’re having troubles with, what did not work in your recipe. And I really feel like that is one of many solely methods to form of get higher. And I form of take that method with social media too.

So. Um, I really like to speak to my viewers. So any, anybody who DMs me on Instagram, they will get me. I’m going to reply to them. Um, I like to put up like polls and surveys and ask me a query issues on Instagram so I can hear from my viewers and, um, I like to reply them. I adore it when, you realize, they ship me there.

Once they’ve made one in all my recipes, um, I reply to it, individuals e-mail me their photographs. I reply to it. So, you realize, it isn’t rocket science or something, however I do assume that some individuals lose that closeness to their viewers, um, whether or not it is simply not their factor or whether or not they outsource it or nonetheless, however I really feel prefer it’s an enormous worth add to your small business and.

I imply, these are your readers. These are who you are creating for. And, um, it is so extremely priceless to me to have that suggestions and to essentially hearken to what persons are saying and what they’re asking for. And, you realize, and that is, what’s helped me. Like we have been speaking in regards to the totally different names of components earlier than.

That is how I do know is as a result of individuals say, I do not know what that’s. I do not know. Um, um, I would not know, you realize, that in any other case. So. It has been so extremely useful, um, for my enterprise and, you realize, different issues is like doing reader surveys. Um, and. Yeah, simply something actually to get the dialog to method and I do not find out about you, however I get so unhappy when, like, in case you contact somebody, like, as a result of I do know not everybody may be contactable 24 7, however you realize, once you attain out to somebody after which they do not reply and it is like, actually unhappy.

And then you definately’re like. Are they not very good in individual or did they simply not see it? And also you form of need to, so I simply, I simply really feel like once you try this, generally it is simply this additional advert that individuals usually get actually shocked they usually’re actually grateful that they really do hear from you and that you just’re comfortable to take the time of day to reply their questions.

And I believe I form of view it as, um, form of like customer support. So it is identical to the customer support that I would like my enterprise to. 

Jared: So, properly, you realize what they are saying, by no means meet your heroes.

So that you simply stated it, you had it in our agenda and I actually need to double down on this. I believe it is actually fascinating as a result of I’ve, I’ve interviewed lots of people through the years and I’ve by no means heard anyone ever as soon as confer with their web site and the issues that they do, whether or not it is web site, whether or not it is social media, whether or not it is e-mail as customer support.

Now, in case you have been to go to a. And I am utilizing air quotes right here for an entire host of causes. Anybody who’s listened to the information podcast this 12 months will know why I am utilizing air quotes proper now. However in case you have been to go to an actual enterprise, air quotes utilized, customer support is consistently talked about, proper? Like I personal a enterprise.

We discuss customer support day by day. There’s people who find themselves devoted to customer support. Most corporations have individuals devoted to customer support. But after we get into this world, we stay in now this web site creation world. I’ve actually by no means heard the phrases customer support stated as soon as on this podcast over years and years of internet hosting.

As we discuss web sites, discuss that extra. Like, I simply need to hear extra of your ideas on customer support and the way you view it in your web site. Is it simply replying to feedback or does it go even additional? How do you apply that? Hmm. 

Jessica: Um, that, yeah, I believe. Look, after I do a whole lot of issues with my weblog, I believe, um, from my very own viewpoint, and for me, good customer support is so extremely priceless.

Like, after I consider, um, after I consider even there’s some folks that I accomplice with, with my website, like my, my advert firm, um, and. Um, however even I am pondering in my, in my house life, like, um, you realize, after we’ve purchased out lounge suites or like simply all types of issues, I can actually come to thoughts when individuals have gone above and past their customer support, after they’ve handled us so properly that I believe to myself.

So grateful that I cannot go to anybody else as a result of it does not actually matter in regards to the worth. It does not actually matter about what they’re promoting. For those who provide me that customer support, like I’ll come again and I’ll pay for that. And never solely that, like I’ll inform all my pals, which I do. Um, and I believe.

There’s simply a lot energy in that and in the identical method once you get pork up within the service, prefer it leaves such a nasty style in your mouth, proper? And I simply assume it is such a straightforward factor and a free factor. For, I imply, other than time for me to supply, um, that may actually set me aside. And to be sincere, it is one thing that I actually take pleasure in as a result of it’s that non-public connection as a result of on the finish of the day, this, you realize, web sites are, you realize.

The display screen and you’ll really feel very such as you’re behind the display screen. Folks disguise behind it. Um, you’ll be able to really feel very eliminated, very lonely since you’re working from house or wherever you are working, however, um, it is a actual approach to construct connection and construct reference to the model. So. I do not ever need to be an internet site the place, you realize, a whole lot of these massive meals media web sites are like, you realize, individuals, they, they arrive they usually go, they arrive they usually go.

And that is as a result of, like, even when the recipe is nice, like, it does not have any which means behind it. However in case you, in case you come and you’re feeling such as you meet me, and then you definately attempt one in all my recipes and also you adore it, and then you definately ship me a photograph after which I say, wow, like, you probably did actually nice. And even generally not prefer it did not work out, however I say, Oh, Hey, perhaps do that subsequent time, or thanks for letting me know, I’ll attempt it in my kitchen and redo it or no matter it’s.

Like then, I imply, there’s only a human connection there. I imply, it isn’t rocket science, however we love like human connection and I really like human connection. And I believe. It is what’s going to preserve individuals coming again to my website. And I do not say that in a, um, of goody, like they arrive again to my website, I get to earn more money.

Nevertheless it’s like, these are the folks that I actually need to come to my website. These are the folks that I need to work together with. And so they make my recipes they usually take pleasure in them. And so they, you realize, primarily take pleasure in me. And that is that pleasure that we get to share with one another. Um, And type of, and that is why I do what I do, if that is sensible.

However on the finish of the day, I simply assume it is a actually priceless factor that companies can do. Um, that does not value some huge cash that on the finish of the day is so priceless for you as a result of it retains you within the mindset of your reader, near your reader to know what they need. And I say reader, you realize, for different individuals, it is, you realize, the viewers, not essentially the reader, however, um.

Yeah, and, and I believe it might carry a whole lot of pleasure as properly. Although generally it’s important to undergo the troubleshooting. I imply, not each remark is a pleasant remark, however yeah. On the finish of the day, I believe it’s a very, superb factor and a very simple factor. And now with social media, it is simply getting simpler and simpler to, to remain near our readers.

Jared: How do you, like, what, what suggestions do you’ve gotten for undertaking all that you just do on the number of platforms you are on? I imply, we’re, you realize, into this interview now you are clearly creating new content material and there is a whole lot of depth that goes into that. You are additionally updating outdated content material and you take that content material, you are placing it on the internet.

Uh, on a wide range of social media channels, you are emailing your, your, your viewers, how, you realize, how are you, is there a course of you comply with? Um, is there a method you are form of maximizing your capability to be energetic on all these platforms? Um, 

Jessica: when the youngsters fall asleep, do every little thing. Um, so I, in the mean time I am.

, I am a keep at house mother. I’ve received a 3 12 months outdated and a 9 month outdated. So I work each time I get the prospect, which is not an entire lot to be sincere. So that is all coming from somebody who I’d say is certainly working half time. Um, however one thing I discovered from after I did this as a facet hustle for six years is you could solely do what you are able to do.

And there are such a lot of social platforms, such as you talked about, that I can not be energetic on all of them. , um, and. Uh, as a lot as I wish to, that is simply not the place I am at in the mean time. And I simply haven’t got that capability. Um, so I believe the most effective factor that you are able to do is simply select the place to place your time.

And so, you realize, for me, like I discussed, Instagram is an enormous channel for me and it is someplace the place I have been energetic for a few years and I’ve a whole lot of, um, viewers, uh, interplay there. So that is what I prioritize. Um, after which I’ve. Pinterest is not is the subsequent massive one after which like I barely do a lot on Fb and far on TikTok and far on YouTube and that is one thing I undoubtedly wish to change, however I simply type of need to make peace with the truth that that I can not get to that in the mean time, however in saying that I nonetheless monitor the feedback.

So I also have a, I’ve a VA who’s been serving to me the final couple of years, um, with creating pins and serving to me handle my Pinterest schedule. And we, um, nonetheless keep watch over Pinterest feedback and reply them collectively. Um, and he or she emails me each time there’s. Yeah, ones that I have to be, um, taking care of, however she, she does assist me handle that as a result of I truly solely, did you even know there was Pinterest feedback after which they came upon there was Pinterest feedback like just a few years in the past and there is all these like a whole bunch of feedback over and I felt so unhealthy that for years and years, I did not notice that individuals have been truly commenting.

Um, so sure, so now we reply all of these, um, and I monitor Fb as properly, however, um, Yeah, look, you’ll be able to solely do it. There’s solely so many hours within the day. And I do know even when I used to be working full time and had all that point, there’s most likely nonetheless social media that I could not get to. So, yeah, I do not need my recommendation to return throughout like it’s important to be all to everybody and drown in your social media accounts as a result of it might get very overwhelming, however simply as a lot as you’ll be able to.

Um, it is simply nice to be current. If that is a worth to you and your small business, 

Jared: what do you assume, as a result of, you realize, I am going to hit you form of with the alternative facet or the satan’s advocate to all this, which is there’s a whole lot of meals blogs and, um, and recipe web sites on the web immediately. What’s it about your website and about your model that you just assume has been so profitable and has stood out and proceed to develop 12 months over 12 months over 12 months as you have been, as you have been engaged on this?

Yeah, 

Jessica: um, two issues. I believe the primary is my recipes work, so there’s a whole lot of dud recipes on the market, however I’ll say that I believe for majority of individuals my recipes do work they usually do produce one thing that is It is very scrumptious. And likewise I believe I’ve niched right down to, I am not simply, um, you realize, I am not only a baking or dessert blogger.

I actually do hone into being a house baker and I like to create fast and simple recipes. So I believe that’s the particular viewers that I am aiming at and that is who I’ve discovered through the years. And I believe there was most likely a bit hole perhaps available in the market the place there wasn’t. Um, there simply wasn’t an entire lot, particularly in Australia.

There wasn’t truly an entire lot of, um, blogs or web sites actually catering to that. Um, so I really feel like I discovered that which is, which has been actually nice. And that is most likely the place I discovered a few of my success. Um, and the second factor is consistency. So we have talked about how I’ve had a continuing lack of time as a result of that is, you realize, facet hustle and blah, blah, blah.

Um, however the one factor I can say, I’ve by no means been, I’ve needed to be taught search engine marketing. I’ve needed to be taught meals images. I’ve needed to discover ways to bake. I’ve needed to discover ways to write. Nicely, I type of knew tips on how to write, however tips on how to write for search engine marketing or for my readers and recipes was very particular. Um, and the one factor I can say over these 10 years is I have been constant.

I’ve performed this. Week in, week out, each week night time, each weekend, um, for 10 years and there is simply one thing to be stated for those that can stick it out in these, uh, on this world, on this running a blog world. So like, you realize, I’ve seen lots of people come and go, lots of people get discouraged, um, lots of people end their blogs or promote their blogs, um, which is, you realize, completely superb.

Um, however I believe. Yeah, a few of my success has virtually purely simply been as a result of I, I am nonetheless right here, I am nonetheless right here, I am nonetheless displaying up, I am nonetheless attempting to be taught and yeah, one thing to be stated for time, I believe sticking round 

Jared: for some time. Yeah, you realize, it is a good reminder. It is very easy to take a look at perhaps the final month of outcomes or the final three months of outcomes, or take a look at the final seasonal replace or the final Google replace or no matter, however oftentimes individuals who discuss success, discuss taking this very long run view.

And once you pull that graph again, you begin to see that a whole lot of what we may be residing in proper now may be very small compared to the bigger journey. Yeah. 

Jessica: Yeah. And I believe that is, you realize, fortunately I wasn’t hit with the useful content material replace, however I, you realize, I’ve heard how devastating that has been for some individuals and I can solely think about how devastated I’d be if I received decimated by that.

However I believe. Yeah. For individuals in that situation, I’d simply be saying like, simply grasp in there as a result of in case you can grasp in there and you’ll preserve going and you may make some adjustments, like, you realize, it might, it might flip round for you, however it simply relies upon in case you’re keen to hold in there and preserve going.

Jared: Closing query from me and it has to do all the way in which again to what you introed with once you talked about the place the location was at immediately and also you talked about the way you’re monetized on, on Mediavine with advert site visitors. Have you ever tried another? Types of monetization. Have you considered including anything or are you doing another types of, of incomes income from the location?

Jessica: Yeah, I have been very fortunate that I’ve been capable of keep, um, a very good earnings by means of adverts, however I’ve performed, I do some little bit of affiliate. Um, however to be sincere, it does not achieve this properly in Australia, like even like Amazon, as a result of, um. Nicely, a whole lot of my site visitors is to us and anyway, it is this complete factor in regards to the hyperlinks and blah, blah, blah.

So a bit little bit of affiliate, um, and I’ve labored with just a few manufacturers through the years and performed a bit bit of name work, however I do not do so much. Um, I am very protecting of my model. I get requested to do some bizarre and wacky issues they usually’re simply not on model for me. So, um, yeah, I solely work with a really choose few manufacturers perhaps a few occasions a 12 months.

Um, Uh, in any other case, yeah, it has been purely advert income. I’d like to launch a product someday, however yeah, we’ll simply see within the subsequent few years what I can rise up to. And I’d love to put in writing a guide in the future. That may be the dream. So we’ll 

Jared: see. Again to time once more. Yeah. , there’s solely so many hours of the day, proper?

Jessica: And it will be fascinating to see. I believe we’re all holding our breath for 2024. What is going on to occur with adverts and, you realize, AI and all that type of factor. So I am simply. Yeah, I am sitting right here questioning what is going on to occur, however I am holding on and having fun with the experience whereas I can. 

Jared: Good. Yeah. Good reply. I imply, yeah, you are precisely proper.

I imply, going again to the way in which that you just method social media, the way in which you are approaching income streams, like, you realize, attempt to not overcommit, but in addition ensuring that you just’re concerned to the purpose the place your viewers is. 

Jessica: Yeah, yeah, that is proper. And simply having fun with it as a result of on the finish of the day, I believe generally you’ll be able to actually hope to achieve, you realize, these magical numbers, whether or not it’s in site visitors or in {dollars} and every little thing.

However I imply, that is enjoyable. Like, it is so enjoyable figuring this out. And that is one of many explanation why I really like listening to your podcast is as a result of I am at all times getting like. Little gems and studying from individuals or like once you guys cowl the information, I adore it. Like listening since you simply give me like this fast abstract, but in addition like, I identical to fester on it for the week, you realize, questioning, Ooh, what did that imply and what is going on to occur?

And so like, it is a actually thrilling time, although it is, you realize, type of a bit terrifying. It is thrilling. So yeah, you simply received to take pleasure in, take pleasure in this wild running a blog search engine marketing world that 

Jared: we stay in. It’s a wild experience. That is an ideal approach to transition. The place can individuals comply with together with you in 2024 and past on this wild experience?

Um, clearly now we have your web site, which I am going to hyperlink to on this present notes, sweetest menu. com, however another locations that individuals can comply with alongside on. Yeah. 

Jessica: Come be part of me on Instagram. Um, simply my handles at sweetest menu. And, um, yeah, now we have a number of enjoyable over there. Okay. 

Jared: Nice. Uh, Jessica, this hour flew by. Thanks for approaching the podcast.

It was nice to have you ever and continued success in your web site. Uh, actually want you all the most effective. Thanks.

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